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     GSD community hits back at Kennel Club

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    PostSubject: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Fri Feb 12, 2010 3:42 pm

    this is a very long post but it might interest some on here
    and Mo Lakin (Mascani) has added a comment too



    GSD community hits back at Kennel Club

    THE
    KENNEL Club has spoken out again this week on the German Shepherd Dog
    debate, and said that a vocal minority within the breed are continuing
    to distract attention from the KC’s main concerns regarding soundness
    in the breed.

    In the statement, which was
    issued to the press on Monday morning, the KC said that it remained in
    no doubt that currently the single biggest threat to the reputation and
    interest of the breed is the lack of soundness in hindquarters,
    particularly the hocks.

    The release continued: ‘The presence of this unsoundness in GSDs is
    generally recognised by most people in dogs except by some with vested
    interests in the GSD breed, who steadfastly refuse to acknowledge that
    there is a problem in this area. The Kennel Club remains frustrated
    that something so patently obvious to many dog people - even those with
    a limited knowledge of dogs - is being ignored and denied by some
    people in the breed. Indeed the recent Bateson Inquiry singled out the
    GSD as an example of a breed ‘where drastic action is required’ to
    address conformation and movement.

    ‘The GSD community has commendably introduced a number of valuable
    voluntary health testing schemes addressing issues such as haemophilia,
    hip dysplasia and others. The Kennel Club has supported this voluntary
    testing and will continue to support all responsible breeders who put
    the health of their animals first. These tests are undeniably
    important, but crucially they do not address the most important current
    issue – lack of soundness in the hindquarters and hocks.’
    However, the GSD Partnership immediately hit back, saying that there
    had been no attempt from anyone in the GSD community to distract
    attention from any matter that impacts on the health issues of the
    breed. In its reply, the Partnership stated: ‘The Kennel Club is well
    aware from the long discussions that have taken place with the GSD
    Partnership, that the issue of soundness in the hocks is one which has
    been acknowledged as requiring particular attention. They have chosen
    to ignore the representation from the Partnership as the collective
    group who represent all the GSD Clubs and go direct to the clubs.’

    However, the Kennel Club says that the GSD Partnership has repeatedly
    claimed that the Kennel Club is not accepting its proposed Breed
    Improvement Programme and its requests that the Programme forms the
    basis of a mandatory requirement for showing and breeding. The fact
    remains, accorting to the KC, that no part of the proposed Programme
    acknowledges, let alone addresses, the issue of soundness in the
    hindquarters and hocks.

    David Payne of the Videx GSD told OUR DOGS: ‘I can categorically state
    the GSD breed has been tackling unsoundness of the hocks for many
    decades. This problem can never be eliminated, it needs controlling, in
    a similar way hip dysplasia and other diseases cannot be eliminated but
    need controlling. The GSD breed does not need lectures, threats, or
    intimidation from the Kennel Club on the subject of unsound hocks or
    any other health screening issues. The Kennel Club can be taught a huge
    amount on these issues by the GSD fraternity.’

    Fundamental
    The
    Kennel Club says it believes that the health and soundness of dogs
    should be the fundamental and overriding concern of breeders. The
    improvement of soundness in the GSD lies with GSD breeders, owners and
    judges all working towards the same goal. The judge’s role is a vital
    one in the development of many aspects of a breed, but one of their
    primary responsibilities is to ensure that unsound dogs are not
    rewarded in the show ring.

    ‘This issue of
    soundness is not a simple difference of opinion, it is the fundamental
    issue of the breed’s essential conformation and movement,’ the KC said.

    All GSD breed clubs have been asked by the Kennel Club to sign a formal
    Undertaking that ‘accepts that there is a degree of unsoundness in the
    hindquarters of the breed and in particular in the hocks of some dogs
    and that these problems are to be penalised at shows.’ They have
    further been asked to undertake positive action to address this
    unsoundness issue. The KC says that GSD owners and breeders have the
    chance now to make a positive impact on the future of their breed by
    supporting the Kennel Club’s measures to address this essential factor.
    Owners and breeders should make their views known to the breed clubs
    that represent them and ask that the Undertakings be signed for the
    future protection and welfare of this breed.

    Joe Summerhill, GSD Partnership co-ordinator remains unconvinced: ‘It
    is amazing that the KC still say the GSD Partnership and Community are
    doing nothing about their concern when on the 21st November 2009 the
    GSDP held a forum attended by over 100 GSD enthusiasts who debated the
    issue and confirmed to the KC in writing on the 26th November 2009 that
    they acknowledged their issue and, among other initiatives, agreed to
    run a Judges seminar to highlight the point.
    ‘It is intriguing that the KC has not responded to the letter despite
    two reminders, as to do so would clearly undermine their current
    tactics of falsely stating that there has been no action from the GSD
    Community. Some members of the GSD Community are looking forward to
    alternative showing of demonstrably healthy animals who have passed
    mandatory health tests, outside the KC control.

    ‘The KC have been put under notice by both the APGAW and Bateson
    reports that if the KC does not impose mandatory health requirements
    for dogs they register then other organisations will. It has started.

    ‘The time for the KC to realise they are overseeing a business critical
    period in their existence and that to simply push mandatory health
    requirement “upstairs” by lobbying the government is a tactic that may
    ultimately see them lose the position they currently uniquely have.
    Alternative registration initiatives and showing of dogs outside KC
    licensed shows for animals who have passed mandatory health
    requirements for their breed has started and will continue as long as
    the KC continue on avoiding the opportunity they have to change.

    ‘We have again this week written to ask for a meeting on the KCs
    progress on implementing Mandatory health restrictions for all KC
    registered pedigree GSDs.’

    Undesirable
    Mo Lakin of the Mascani GSDs, told OUR DOGS: ‘ Firstly, I would comment that this is the first time I have ever seen the KC write any issue on our breed that has not had the word (Alsation) in brackets after its
    name. The KC speaks of a vocal minority attempting to distract from the
    issue on unsoundness - and this being the Kennel Club’s main concern!
    Now we are talking turkey!


    ‘Unsoundness is
    really undesirable, and there is not a breeder in the land that would
    say otherwise. but what percentage of the breed is the Kennel Club
    considering to be unsound? All of them? 50% - 25% - all show dogs? They
    are all being promoted in some way or another by the K.C, are they
    registering these dogs? Are they going to continue to register these
    dogs, once found? Can they de-register a dog that becomes unsound -
    what about the veteran classes and our lovely oldies coming out for the
    day? the kennel club must behave in a more professional manner, this is
    not about unsoundness, it is clearly being seen to be doing something
    about some issue that doesn't cost you money on registrations. It’s
    about bullying a set of pro-active people that are addressing health
    issues much more than themselves, and not wanting to take an initiative
    because it will cost too many registration fees.

    ‘The KC needs to address hip dysplasia. Stop registering un-scored or
    unfavourable scores - give the puppy farmers something to worry about -
    start making all the health tests that concerned and caring breeders
    pay good money to do, count.

    ‘Also, the KC needs to get a grip of haemophilia, to make sure every
    male dog has to be tested to be shown or used. The list goes on, but
    that list costs registration money and "unsound" dogs have no
    particular test to give a clinical overview - so our KC is safe - they
    can register the newborns from us all, because there is never going to
    be a test that can conclude that this dog should not be shown. There is
    every opportunity to do that right now - cut the risk of hip dysplasia
    right down - I put it to the KC to stop registering un-checked animals
    - even give a date as to when this action will start - but make it
    within our lifetime... then you will get credibility from the people
    that really care and strive to do the right thing.

    ‘We are asked by the Kennel Club to sign a formal Undertaking that
    ‘accepts that there is a degree of unsoundness in the hindquarters of
    the breed.’No clinical evidence, no percentages given? No proof that
    the issue is as big as the KC would like the public to think to cover
    its own tracks of instability on the health issue side of the GSD. No
    thank you!

    Passionate
    ‘The
    letter was, in my opinion, a threat. it went severely wrong because we
    are not people sitting in offices, we are people passionate about our
    breed and have not taken the letter sitting down –many of us are
    professional people in our own right and know the limits of conduct
    and, as this letter has not given the result the KC thought it would,
    is why you they are calling us vocal. The KC has found a little niche
    in unsoundness and has played on it without giving us any answers.
    ‘The KC says that it supports the GSD community in their voluntary
    health tests - and will continue to support us. How? It then goes on
    the say that ‘These tests are undeniably important, but crucially they
    do not address the most important current issue – lack of soundness in
    the hindquarters and hocks.’ Where is the KC coming from? Have any of
    them seen a dog or an owner in dire distress from dealing with hip
    dysplasia or a status epilepticus? Have they seen a dog that has a
    degree of unsoundness? Try to compare the two.

    ‘The GSD Partnership is a band of very well respected business people,
    respected in all walks of life, except, it would seem by the KC. The KC
    states: ‘This issue of soundness is not a simple difference of opinion,
    it is the fundamental issue of the breed’s essential conformation and
    movement.’ We agree. We also know that it is not 100% and rising, it is
    a problem that is no more prevalent in our breed than in some others,
    and a problem that can and is being dealt with by breeding programmes
    and by surveying animals and of course hopefully by judging, although
    the KC approve the judges.

    ‘Some of us in the breed are now saying OK, keep your CCs, because if
    that’s our governing body, do we need it. The answer is no.

    ‘I personally feel that the letter is flawed and dictatorial. In the
    main, GSD people are thrilled with the Bateson report, we have even
    gone to the length of writing to Mr Bateson’s secretary to see how soon
    it can be implemented.

    ‘I want to give the KC a challenge. Contact the Media - let us have a
    serious debate with the best of the KC’s and the best of ours - let
    there be a mediator, keeping us to health issues - I would talk to the
    KC any day in front of Joe public and I would be happy to put my
    concerns to the test.’
    David Payne concluded: ‘The National GSD Breed Warden, Reinhardt Meyer,
    of the SV in Germany, addressed a meeting of all GSD Breed judges
    within Germany in January 2009 and told them that unsoundness of the
    hocks (and GSD size) must be more strenuously dealt with and all judges
    must penalise dogs so affected, by degree, and place them “down the
    line” at shows. This “instruction” has resonated around the GSD world.

    Hereditary
    ‘The
    GSD world community, of which ‘we’ in the UK are very active members,
    do not need the Kennel Club to bully our breed into submission on any
    health issue. Our record is second to none. Can anyone imagine the GSD
    breed, which introduced the BVA/KC hip scheme into the United Kingdom,
    needing any lessons on health or apparent health issues related to the
    German Shepherd Dog?

    ‘In my opinion, The
    Kennel Club continues to attempt to distract from the most serious
    health concerns of GSD and all Pedigree Dogs, which are proven
    hereditary diseases, for which there are “health screening” available,
    mainly through the British Veterinary Association (BVA).

    ‘Unsound hocks have no known health related diseases. They may, in the
    extreme, cause premature tiredness in a working dog, and as such it
    needs to be addressed, but unsound hocks are hardly in the same league
    of health issues as Hip Dysplasia, Elbow Dysplasia, Haemophilia or
    Juvenile Renal Dysplasia, all of which have scientific health screening
    available.

    ‘As for the Kennel Club stating that the GSD Partnership (GSDP)
    proposed “Planned Improvement Programme” (PIP) did not address the
    issue of soundness in the hocks, this is complete nonsense. The GSDP
    could very easily have included it, and the Kennel Club know this and
    they could have asked for it to be included, they did not. The Kennel
    Club simply failed to enter into meaningful discussions with the GSDP.

    ‘The Kennel Club are also failing, in my opinion, to satisfactorily
    answer many very genuine concerns that have arisen from the
    “undertaking” – apparently preferring GSD Clubs to sign under duress. I
    have over 30 year of considerable knowledge and experience in the GSD
    breed. I am a Championship Show Judge, I have judged our GSD breed
    throughout the world, and written many articles on the breed.

    ‘I believe the Kennel Club has missed a golden opportunity to explore
    and embrace many exciting proposals and ideas emanating from the GSD
    community.’































































    _________________


    "My sunshine doesn't come from the skies, it comes from the love in my dogs eyes."

    R.I.P Scouse xx Saffron xx and Roxanne xx I will Never Walk Alone..Still Miss you all.

    I am a Volunteer for UK-German Shepherd Rescue.
    http://www.ukgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk/


    Last edited by liverbird on Fri Feb 12, 2010 3:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Fri Feb 12, 2010 3:51 pm

    i saw something about this on fb....and then ems e-mailed it to me...

    way to go mo mascanis and videx gsd's and many others who were there to support the good breeding of gsd's ... i dont understand it all that much tbh :2431:

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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Fri Feb 12, 2010 3:54 pm

    fredsmum wrote:
    i saw something about this on fb....and then ems e-mailed it to me...

    way to go mo mascanis and videx gsd's and many others who were there to support the good breeding of gsd's ... i dont understand it all that much tbh :2431:


    nor me Shelley
    i'm glad mine are pets tbh
    I couldn't be doing with all these long winded debates

    _________________


    "My sunshine doesn't come from the skies, it comes from the love in my dogs eyes."

    R.I.P Scouse xx Saffron xx and Roxanne xx I will Never Walk Alone..Still Miss you all.

    I am a Volunteer for UK-German Shepherd Rescue.
    http://www.ukgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk/
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Fri Feb 12, 2010 3:59 pm

    I once contemplated showing fred .... im glad i didnt tbh... too much jargon for my liking....i barely understand any of it lol ...

    theyre doing their best for the gsd breed though....so fair play to them...

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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Fri Feb 12, 2010 4:25 pm

    deffo

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    R.I.P Scouse xx Saffron xx and Roxanne xx I will Never Walk Alone..Still Miss you all.

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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:05 pm

    David Payne cant half waffle

    He does bring up great points about the GSD but his letters always go on forever i usually give up reading them half way through i lose the gist of what hes talking about after 10 minutes reading

    btw hes Keiras breeder Hes definately very knowledgable on the breed
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 3:52 pm

    :2431:

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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 4:11 pm

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    http://www.dogtalk4us.com Online
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 7:35 pm

    BrenA wrote:
    David Payne cant half waffle

    He does bring up great points about the GSD but his letters always go on forever i usually give up reading them half way through i lose the gist of what hes talking about after 10 minutes reading

    btw hes Keiras breeder Hes definately very knowledgable on the breed


    you old name dropper you

    _________________


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    R.I.P Scouse xx Saffron xx and Roxanne xx I will Never Walk Alone..Still Miss you all.

    I am a Volunteer for UK-German Shepherd Rescue.
    http://www.ukgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk/
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 7:41 pm

    Hope he doesnt come on this site
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:10 pm



    what was his name again Bren

    _________________


    "My sunshine doesn't come from the skies, it comes from the love in my dogs eyes."

    R.I.P Scouse xx Saffron xx and Roxanne xx I will Never Walk Alone..Still Miss you all.

    I am a Volunteer for UK-German Shepherd Rescue.
    http://www.ukgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk/
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    BrenA



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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:26 pm

    You taking the piss Karen
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:29 pm

    who karen taking the piss







    thats all she does

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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:32 pm

    BrenA wrote:
    You taking the piss Karen




    who me
    i was thinking of inviting him on the forum Bren

    _________________


    "My sunshine doesn't come from the skies, it comes from the love in my dogs eyes."

    R.I.P Scouse xx Saffron xx and Roxanne xx I will Never Walk Alone..Still Miss you all.

    I am a Volunteer for UK-German Shepherd Rescue.
    http://www.ukgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk/
    Back to top Go down
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    liverbird
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    PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:33 pm

    fredsmum wrote:
    who karen taking the piss

    thats all she does


    _________________


    "My sunshine doesn't come from the skies, it comes from the love in my dogs eyes."

    R.I.P Scouse xx Saffron xx and Roxanne xx I will Never Walk Alone..Still Miss you all.

    I am a Volunteer for UK-German Shepherd Rescue.
    http://www.ukgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk/
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